Response to Kyle

Praise be to the LORD God, the God of Israel
       who alone does marvelous deeds. Psalm 72:18

No offense intended to the author of this blog entry, or for the one who asked the initial question, but, if Christians are so dead set against bullying, harassment, etc., then why do you constantly promote it towards GLBT kids? If you are so dead set against bullying, harassment, etc., against people per se, then why don't you come out against those who are doing the bullying, etc..., instead of joining in? The National Day of Silence is helping to promote peace between people who otherwise couldn't or wouldn't agree on anything. If Christians want respect, then they need to show it first. Thank you, Kyle - 19, Pennsylania

We received an interesting response to the post regarding the National Day of Silence. His comment and question appear above.

Thank you, Kyle, for commenting. First of all, I want to re-emphasize what was said in my post regarding violence and unkind treatment of others.  It is wrong to be hateful, to mock and hurt others, regardless of their sexual persuasions. Such behavior is simply not an option for Christians who represent Christ.

 

In response you raise the question that if Christians condemn this kind of violence, why do we then promote it? Sadly, there is much done in the name of Christianity that is not consistent with what the Bible teaches. The problem you mention is not so much a Christian problem as it is a human problem. Man often responds with violence or bullying to things that he disagrees with. This response is wrong, and it indicates there is a larger problem for mankind.  As humans, we tend to rebel against the authority of God. Violence against others because of a philosophical disagreement is wrong. I believe that you would agree with that statement. But if you do agree, then it is fair to ask why it is wrong. In other words, by what standard can we denounce violence of the sort that concerns you?

While this is not the place for a lengthy response, let me attempt to address this issue briefly. You might appeal to your own personal sense of moral outrage as the basis for something being wrong when you want others to change their behavior. But that is not sufficient. Something more is needed. Human history and current cultural practice show that in some cultures violence is a perfectly acceptable way to resolve disagreements. Some cultures even go so far as to condone having the losing party in a dispute as the main course for supper. So, if a personal code of conduct is the standard, then you really don’t have a basis for being upset with someone who responds in violence to those he dislikes. That individual has as much right as you do to determine the appropriateness of his actions. If you are going to condemn violence there must be a standard with more authority than a personal code of conduct. This is true for both individuals and governments. Governmental codes of conduct that are based upon the will of the people are nothing more than a collection of personal codes of conduct. A review of political history bears out that different governments have different standards of behavior. So, the question still remains, why is one type of conduct wrong and another right?

Christians believe that God has given a consistent standard of conduct which transcends personal and governmental standards.  That standard is given in the Bible. Now, before you get too upset with this answer, remember that your own comment indicates that some human behaviors are clearly wrong. My question to you, then, is, Why is that behavior wrong? As I just explained, it is not possible to appeal to human standards because human standards and laws are inconsistent with each other. Christians learn from the Bible that violent behavior against GLBT students is wrong. However, the Bible also teaches that the only appropriate place for sexual activity is within heterosexual marriage. This belief does not come from Christians but from God, who in fact does transcend the laws and standards of men. God is the ultimate judge and arbiter of human behavior.

Kyle, my question to you is, “Does God have the right to determine how people should relate to each other sexually?” If you answer “No,” then you have made God out to be just another person with an opinion, with no more authority than you or I have.  He is no God at all. But if you believe that there is no God, then on what basis do you say that violence against others is wrong? Why is your opinion right and mine wrong? If you want to condemn bigotry and prejudice, then you must have some standard that defines bigotry and prejudice. This standard must be based upon something other than just a personal preference if you want to regulate the actions of others. Otherwise, you are attempting to force your will on other people simply because it is your will.

I am glad to denounce discriminatory violence based upon biblical standards. However, because of that same standard I must also urge you to consider whether gay, lesbian, and bisexual behaviors are appropriate. My belief that this activity is wrong is not a personal preference but is consistent with biblical teaching.

You make an appeal for peace, but even peace is something that has no meaning unless it can be rooted in something larger than our own personal beliefs. I know this answer may not be satisfying to you, but biblical Christianity does give a basis from which to speak against discriminatory violence. At the same time, the God who gives this standard also has things to say about sexual behavior. I appeal to you to embrace God’s standard—not only in condemning discriminatory violence, but also for sexual conduct.

The verse quoted at the beginning of this post says that only God does good things. I am sure that you want good things for your life. Trusting in God is the only route to knowing goodness on this planet.

Please let me know your response. Thank you for taking the time to comment and express your thoughts.   

Comments

[Caleb Land]

The comment from Kyle and also an excellent dialogue that I had at my personal blog after asking the initial question show that this is an important and pressing issue to the next generation.

Thank you for your compassionate and biblical response. If you are interested in my discussion with a young lady over this issue, please follow this link:

http://missionalstudents.typepad.com/missional_students/2008/04/national-day-of.html

[Don Fields]

An EXCELLENT example of presuppositional apologetics in the real world! I really appreciate you posting this as I learned a lot from it. So many Christians have no idea how to answer these type of questions as they have little understanding of the connection of worldviews and presuppositions. They also have a low view of Scripture and a high view of personal opinion. In many cases they would be arguing against Kyle using the same argument.